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Russia’s 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade in the Donbass

November 15, 2016

By Askai707

The following investigation was originally posted in Russian by the author, Askai707, on his LiveJournal blog. Translation and foreword by Aric Toler.

The following investigation from Askai707 provides a significant amount of evidence that proves the direct participation of Russia’s 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade (often referred to as just the “61st Naval Infantry Brigade” or “61st Brigade” in the translation) in the Ukrainian Conflict, particularly in villages near Luhansk in the summer and fall of 2014. Askai identifies about a dozen Russian servicemen who were photographed and filmed in Luhansk at a separatist base in 2014 — many of whom were awarded medals by decree of the Russian President after returning home, and continued serving as active servicemen.

These men who were photographed and filmed fighting in Ukraine in 2014 were not volunteers. These men were not locals. These men were not “on vacation” and acting outside of their duties as servicemen of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.

These men were, and in some cases still are, active servicemen of the Russian Federation. They continued to serve as soldiers after returning from Ukraine and were recognized by a presidential decree with medals that rewarded them for their participation in combat. These men participated in a military operation organized and executed by the Russian Federation against the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Units of the 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade were among the groups of servicemen of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation that participated in combat activities in the Luhansk Oblast in 2014. Like the 200th Separate Motorized Infantry Brigade, which also participated in combat activities in the Donbass in 2014, the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade (military unit 38643) is located in the Pechensky region of the Murmansk Oblast, in the village of Sputnik. This investigation will present both direct and indirect evidence regarding the participation of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade in the war in the Donbass.

Most of the direct evidence regarding the participation of this brigade in the war is in photographic and video evidence, showing that the Russian naval infantrymen were in Luhansk at the end of August and beginning of September. At this time, the personnel and military equipment of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade were stationed on the former territory of the Ukrainian National Guard’s miltary unit 3035, located at Luhansk, Shchadenko, 17.  The following photographs and video shots were taken from this location, and were shared on the social media pages of the servicemen of Russia’s 61st Naval Infantry Brigade.

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Thanks to the availability of so many old photographs uploaded by Ukrainian soldiers who used to serve in military unit 3035 at this same location, there was the opportunity to obtain images for the majority of the objects on the old base that the Russian servicemen and its equipment occupied in 2014. Included in this collection of photographs are the very same buildings and structures that appear in the background of the photographs of the Russian naval infantrymen.

The Group Photograph

In March 2015, Sergeant Igor Bushuev from the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade shared a group photograph on his Vkontakte account, showing seven people in military uniforms without insignia near a BTR-80. In November, this same photograph was on the Vkontakte page of Bushuev’s colleague and fellow naval infantryman Grigory Kislyuk.

Analysis of the individual characteristics of the structures in this photograph shows that the shot was taken in Luhansk on the territory of the Ukrainian National Guard military unit 3035 (located at 48.574066, 39.341229). Below is a comparison of Igor Bushuev’s photograph with an old shot from the social media page of a Ukrainian soldier who served in Luhansk at military unit 3035:

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Additionally, here is the place where the Russian naval infantrymen were photographed, as seen in a video from the Russian state television channel Rossiya-24 from June 4, 2014:

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With the help of social networks, we can identify six of the seven naval infantrymen in the photograph:

From the left to the right, top to the bottom on the photograph, the following servicemen of Russia’s 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade can be seen: Vladimir Stach, Sergey Antonkin, Tofik Sultaliev, Igor Bushuev, Grigory Kislyuk, and Gennady Fedosov.

Vladimir Stach

Sergeant Vladimir Vladimirovich Stach registered on the social network “Vkontakte” under the name Vladimir Vladimirovich (his old, deleted page was under the name Vladimir Stach).

In the photograph below, Vladimir Stach is with his fellow servicemen who were awarded state medals. From left to right we can see: Vladimir himself with the Zhukov Medal, Sergeant Igor Bushuev with the Zhukov Medal, and Sergeant Sergey Stach with the Suvorov Medal. The photograph was taken in the village of Sputnik near the territory of the military unit of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade.

Sergey Antonkin

The next serviceman, before he deleted his account, was registered on the social network Vkontakte under the name Sergey Antonkin. A photograph of him has been saved, showing a flag with the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade’s symbol in the background:

Tofik Sultaliev

The third Russian serviceman from the Luhansk group photograph is Sergeant Tofik Fatali Ogly Sultaliev. On his Vkontakte page, under his “place of employment” he wrote down 38643 — the military unit number for the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade. Additionally, Sultaliev uploaded a photograph (original / archive) showing a warning about power outages in an apartment where we can see his full name, and also that he lives in the village of Sputnik in the Pechenga region.

Igor Bushuev

A photograph of the fourth Russian naval infantrymen is below — the previously-mentioned Sergeant Igor Bushuev.

Grigory Kislyuk

The following serviceman is Grigory Vladimirovich Kislyuk. His old account on Vkontakte, which he has deleted (a screenshot of it has been saved on the site “Mirotvorets”), was under the name Grigory Sedov. There is a photograph there with Grigory in his military uniform that has the chevron of the naval infantry, with his name: “Kislyuk G.V.” His new page was registered under the name Grigory Vladimirovich (archive of a few of the pages here, here, and here).

Below is a saved screenshot of Kislyuk from the deleted account:

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Gennady Fedosov

The last of the identified naval infantrymen is Gennady Fedosov. He also has an account under that name on the social network “Odnoklassniki,” where the previously described group photograph in Luhansk was uploaded. We can also find a photograph of Fedosov in his military uniform near the parade ground of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade. Additionally, Gennady Fedosov can be seen in his military uniform with the naval infantry chevron:

Two Party Videos in Luhansk

On the territory of Ukraine’s National Guard military unit 3055, the Russian naval infantrymen relaxed, sang songs while playing a guitar, and shot all of this on a camera. Two such videos were uploaded online in the winter of 2014-5. The two videos are “here it is” from the Vkontakte page of Aleksandr Pustynnikov and “VID_20120102_061716,” uploaded on an empty account under the name Ichker Kasumkhanov. These two videos will be referred to as the “Pustynnikov video” and “Kasumkhanov video” throughout this investigation.

We can connect these videos to their location with the help of old photographs from Ukrainian servicemen who served at the same location in Luhansk, at military unit 3035.

The screenshot below is from 0:46 from Pustynnikov’s video (see here for an illustration on the Google Earth satellite image shows the angle that the video was shot) and compared with a photograph from military unit 3035:

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Below is a screenshot from 6:02 from Kasumkhanov’s video (see here for an illustration on the Google Earth satellite image shows the angle that the video was shot) and compared with a photograph from military unit 3035:

275724_original 276060_original

Both the video and the photograph were shot in the same place — 48.573833, 39.342000

In both videos, we can clearly hear the sounds of artillery fire or explosions. For Pustynnikov’s video, check at 0:44, and for Kasumkhanov’s video, check around 2:59, 3:36, 4:31, 6:51, and 7:13. The servicemen pay attention to and comment on these artillery sounds.

Despite the low quality of the video clip, we can still identify four Russian servicemen of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade: the previously mentioned Igor Bushuev and Tofik Sultaliev, along with Rustam Suleymanov and Ivan Shcherbatenko.

Sergeant Igor Bushuev lights a cigarette at 0:04 of the Pustynnikov video:

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Sergeant Tofik Sultaliev is in the picture at 0:29 in the Kasumkhanov video:

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Rustam Suleymanov

At 2:17 in the video, we can clearly see the naval infantryman who was registered as Rustam Suleymanov on Vkontakte.

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Unlike his colleagues, Rustam Suleymanov did not indicate on his profile that he serves in the 61st Brigade. However, there is the indirect evidence pointing to this fact, in his uniform and that many of his friends are servicemen of the 61st Brigade. Included among them are Aleksey Syedugin, Nikolay Naymushin, Vladimir Stach, Vladislav Chikomazov, Tofik Sultaliev, and Nikolay Bolshakov. Below is a photograph of Suleymanov in a naval infantry uniform:

Ivan Shcherbatenko

At 1:09 in the Kasumkhanov video, we can see the Russian naval infantryman Ivan Sergeyevich Shcherbatenko:

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Below, we see Ivan Shcherbatenko on the far right in a photograph along with his fellow Russian servicemen:

Along with combat activities in Ukraine, Shcherbatenko has also fought in Syria, and received the medal “For participation in military operations in Syria.”

In the following section of this investigation, we will look at other Russian servicemen of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade who were photographed in 2014 on the territory of the Ukrainian National Guard base in Luhansk and nearby villages.

Other Russian servicemen in Luhansk and its environs

Vladislav Chikomasov

Naval Infantryman Vladislav Sergeyevich Chikomasov can be seen on the left in the photograph below.

A photograph of Chikomasov taken in Luhansk was discovered by InformNapalm investigator Irakli Komakhidze on Chikomazov’s now-deleted Vkontakte page (archive of the new account). A screenshot with this Luhansk photo was saved on the Mirotvorets site.

In the photograph, which was uploaded in February 2015, Vladislav Chikomazov is seen with a fellow serviceman in a military uniform without any insignia, and with weapons in their hands. In the background, we can see the medical station for the Ukrainian military unit 3035. An illustration showing the perspective seen in this photograph with Google Earth satellite imagery can be seen here.

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In the Pustynnikov video, we can see this same medical station and two chairs near its entrance:

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This location is at 48.573778, 39.342167.

Aleksandr Sokolov

From this same location, but with the back of the photographer facing the medical station, a photograph was taken of the Russian naval infantryman Aleksandr Aleksandrovich Sokolov.

This photograph of Sokolov was taken in front of the wall of one of the buildings of the base for the Ukrainian National Guard in Luhansk, military unit 3035. By comparing the exact details of the wall and bricks, we can see that the very same wall was photographed by a Ukrainian serviceman who served in Luhansk.

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Sokolov also poses in front of another building at the former military unit 3035 base near the parade grounds:

This is the same orange building that you can see in the video showing separatist fighters called “LNR. People’s Militia. Military Oath.” In front of the wall there are a few metal sheets, with a tree to the left growing at an angle. See two comparisons below of the photograph of Russian naval infantryman Aleksandr Sokolov with a screenshot from the previously mentioned video:

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In June 2016, Aleksandr Sokolov uploaded photographs and a video clip onto his Vkontakte page (see archives here and here) showing him receiving the state award of the Zhukov Medal in a military commissariat in the Vladimir Oblast in Russia. At the ceremony, a secret decree is read regarding what the awarded is given for: “With the decree of the President of the Russian Federation on 23 November 2015, 470ss [is awarded] for courage, bravery, and selflessness displayed during the performance of military duties in the circumstances…”

Aleksandr Ivchenko

Another Russian serviceman from the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade who was photographed in Luhansk is Aleksandr Ivchenko (his last name and initials can be see on his uniform as “Ivchenko A.G.“). In the photograph below, we can see him on the far-right.

In September 2014, Aleksandr Ivchenko shared a photograph on his pages on the Vkontakte and Odnoklassniki social networks where he, along with other Russian servicemen, are seen with an armored transporter (BTR-80) on the territory of the former Ukrainian National Guard base in Luhansk.

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We can compare the individual details of the roof in the background of Ivchenko’s photograph with the roof as seen in a photograph uploaded by a Ukrainian soldier who used to serve at the military unit 3035 base.

285692_original 285771_original

The coordinates for this location is 48.573972, 39.341611, and an illustration on Google Earth showing the angle of the camera can be seen here.

From the Vkontakte account of the wife of naval infantryman Aleksandr Ivchenko, we can also see that Ivchenko was awarded the medal “For Courage.”

Aleksandr Smolnikov

Other than the naval infantrymen by the armored transporter, we can also see how the artillery unit from the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade participated in the invasion of the Donbass in the summer and fall of 2014, specifically with two 120mm self-propelled mortar systems 2S23 Nona-SVK. This is a quite rare model of military equipment, as there are only 42 of them in the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, and in January 2016 in Ukraine there was one heavily damaged 2S23 that was not fit for action, displayed in a museum/educational area.

The Russian naval infantryman who was registered on Vkontakte as Aleksandr Smolnikov uploaded a photograph in September 2014 where we can see him in Luhansk at the former base of military unit 3035. He is standing between a 2S23 Nona-SVK and an army truck.

Comparison of the 2S23 Nona-SVK in Smoknikov's photograph with a Nona -SVK photographed in St. Petersburg.

Comparison of the 2S23 Nona-SVK in Smoknikov’s photograph with a Nona-SVK photographed in St. Petersburg.

We can geolocate the photograph uploaded by Aleksandr Smoknikov by using open sources. Below, we will compare the features in the background of the Smoknikov photograph with a photograph uploaded by a Ukrainian serviceman who served at the former base for military unit 3035 in Luhansk.

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We can see some of the characteristic objects from the Smoknikov photograph — in particular, two dark spots on the inside of a door, a round yellow marker on the outside of door on a neighboring entryway — in a screenshot from a video of separatists fighters taken at the former base of military unit 3035 in July 2014.

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We can also see the objects from the Smolnikov photograph in a video published by the Russian state television channel Rossiya-24 from June 4, 2014.

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The photograph was shot at 48.574167, 39.341333, and this image shows the angle of the camera from Google Earth satellite imagery.

Nikolay Bolshakov

A photograph taken from the former base of military unit 3035 where we can see two Nona-SVKs was uploaded by a Russian naval infantryman from the 61st Brigade who registered on Vkontakte under the name Nikolay Bolshakov.

In the background of the photograph behind the parade ground, we can see the orange building and metal sheets. In front of these things, on top of a Nona-SVK, is the Russian naval infantryman Aleksandr Sokolov. For further geolocation of this location, see these illustrations from two videos (here and here), and six photographs from Ukrainian soldiers (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6).

Screenshot from the video "LNR. People's militia. Military oath."

Screenshot from the video “LNR. People’s militia. Military oath.

Nikolay Bolshakov’s photograph was taken at 48.573833, 39.341194, and you can see the camera angle on Google Earth satellite imagery here.

Other than the photograph in Luhansk, Bolshakov also uploaded a photograph on his Vkontakte account with a geotag from the village of Vishnevy Dol in the Krasnodon region of the Luhansk Oblast — about 7 kilometers from Luhansk.

We can clearly see electric lines in the background of the photograph to the right of Bolshakov and alongside the road.

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In satellite images on Google Earth and Yandex Maps, and from a video taken from the village of Vishnevy Dol uploaded by the Russian naval infantryman Roman Tertilov, we can see the same grouping of electrical lines along the road. This confirms that Bolshakov’s photograph was taken on the southern edge of this village, at 48.535056, 39.488139.

The objects around the village Vishnevy Dol compared between the Roman Tertilov video and satellite images can be seen here:

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Another Russian naval infantryman from the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade, Ruslan Tartasyuk, took a photograph alongside an improvised checkpoint in Vishnevy Dol, at 48.535556, 39.488389. This photograph was saved on the site gruz200.net.

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At 0:25 of the Roman Tertilov video, we can see the same block with the text “Welcome to the LNR” alongside the posing Tartasyuk.

Another place where the Russian soldiers of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade were photographed is located 5 kilometers south of Vishnevy Dol, on a hill near some plots between the villages of Nikolayevka and Pionerskoe in the Stanichno-Luhansk region of the Luhansk Oblast. The location was determined with the help of blogger Glaz_CBYwnuka. The photographs near Nikolayevka were uploaded in November 2014 onto the Vkontakte page of Russian naval infantryman Grigory Kislyuk (screenshots from his deleted account were saved on Mirotvorets, here and here). Similar photographs were uploaded by Igor Bushuev as well — see the archived pages here: 1, 2, 3, 4.

In these photographs are two of the very same Russian servicemen who were photographed at the Luhansk military base: Sergey Antonkin on the left, and Grigory Kislyuk on the right.

In the next photograph, from left to right we see the following Russian naval infantrymen: Grigory Kislyuk, Vladimir Stach, Genady Fedosov, Igor Bushuev, and an unidentified man.

We can geolocate these photographs with the help of Google Earth satellite images, at 48.577500, 39.530500 (see these examples for geolocation: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5).

Official recognition through awarded medals

For indirect evidence regarding the participation of Russian naval infantrymen in combat activities, we can look to how they were awarded state medals under the decree of the President of the Russian Federation. In this investigation, we have already seen a few examples of awards given to naval infantrymen who were in the Donbass: Vladimir Stach, Igor Bushuev, and Aleksandr Sokolov received the Zhukov Medal, Sergey Stach received the Suvorov Medal, and Aleksandr Ivchenko received the medal “For Courage.”

By researching pages on social media, we can find more examples of medals awarded to servicemen of the Russian 61st Naval Infantry Brigade.

Aleksey Zinakov

Aleksey Sergeyevich Zinakov received a Survorv Medal after a decree from the President of the Russian Federation on November 23, 2015:

Vladimir Fedoseyev

Lieutenant Vladimir Viktorovich Fedoseyev was awarded the Order of Courage after a decree from the President of the Russian Federation on November 23, 2015:

Aleksandr Kulakov

The Order of Courage was also awarded to senior leiutenant Aleksandr Kulakov (his last name and initials can be seen on his uniform: “Kulakov A.V.“):

The only known fatality of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade in Ukraine

It is well-established that an officer from Russia’s 61st Naval Infantry Brigade died due to fighting in the Donbass in 2014 — Vitaly Nikolayevich Trofimov, the head of the engineering service of the 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade. Interactions between the relatives and friends of Vitaly Trofimov were saved on the site cargo200.org, and we can see that he was severely wounded in Ukraine on August 30, 2014. For two days, he was in an Luhansk hospital, and then he was transferred to Rostov, where he died without regaining consciousness.

Reports about the death of Lieutenant Colonel Trofimov appeared on social networks on the accounts of his fellow servicemen in mid-September 2014 (archived messages: 1, 2, 3).

On one of the barracks of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade, a memorial plaque was established in memory of Vitaly Trofimov.

On November 16, 2015, at secondary school №1 in the city of Yalutorovsk, two memorial plaques were established in the memory of naval infantrymen who died during the performance of military duties. One of these was for Vitaly Trofimov. Reports of this were published on the site of the Yalutorovsk secondary school where the plaques were established. A similar notice was published on the Tyumen internet newspaper “Vsluh.ru” (вслух.ру). Regarding the circumstances of Trofimov’s death, the following is written:

The lieutenant colonel of the naval infantry of the Northern Fleet, Vitaly Trofimov, died in 2014 during a special operation.”

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Conclusion

In this investigation, evidence was gathered from open sources that included direct proof of the participation of the 61st Separate Naval Infantry Brigade of the Northern Fleet of the Russian Federation in combat activities in the Donbass during the summer and fall of 2014.

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The reported location of these naval infantrymen of the 61st Brigade are consistent with a map seized by Ukrainian soldiers on August 20, 2014 in a Russian military vehicle from the 234th Airborne Regiment (of the 76th Guards Air Assault Division). On the map, the Russian paratroopers’ “area of responsibility” with the combined tactical group of the Northern Fleet (units of the 61st Naval Infantry Brigade and 200th Motorized Infantry Brigade fought in the Luhansk Oblast, both of these brigades belong to the Northern Fleet) is marked in the southern part of the Stanichno-Luhansk region (the village of Nikolayevka) and the northern part of the Krasnodon region (the village of Vishnevy Dol) of the Luhansk Oblast. Servicemen of the Russian Federation’s 61st Naval Infantry Brigade uploaded photographs of themselves in exactly the same locations.

Map captured from a Russian military vehicle in summer 2014, with the village where Russian servicemen photographed themselves marked by a red arrow

Map captured from a Russian military vehicle in summer 2014, with the village where Russian servicemen photographed themselves marked by a red arrow

Askai707

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70 Comments

  1. CFL68

    Amazing work! Hunt these guys down and bring them to justice. No amnesty for RUS terrorists until the Kremlin acknowledges its guilt, and is held accountable. Only then with full contrition – and after reparations – can amnesty be offered.

    Reply
    • oh my goodnes

      you are one of thes typical dreamers like the song “I am just a dream….”
      Yes you are a dreamer. Hey I want something tell you I lost my Ant und my Uncle hi was shoot by the far right from Lwow or Lutsk etc. Do you think I will se watching when this pics are killing my Family. You are one of this talkers… I dont care about you

      Reply
      • DonM

        May Putin have the same joy at the end of his life as Saddam Husayne, executed by his countrymen in payment of his many crimes.

        Reply
    • Russian

      The question of whether Russian soldiers fighting in Ukraine should be held accountable for their actions (in general, aside from specific incidents or war crimes) is an important, but by no means a simple one. There is a case to be made regarding those who volunteered to go and fight in a different country of their own volition, however, can anyone say for sure how many have vs. those who were simply ordered to go there by their military commanders – orders every rank and file soldier must obey, in which case the soldiers themselves do not carry the responsibility and all the blame should be laid at the feet of those who ordered them to invade a neighboring country. It’s not like they had a choice in the matter if it was a direct order for enlisted men.

      In case of soldiers following unlawful orders that do not breach the accepted norms of military conduct (i.e. an unlawful invasion without committing atrocities) the responsibility should lie squarely on the shoulders of their chain of command with the decision makers at the helm receiving most of the blame. In this case, it is Russia’s policy command, head of state, high-ranking government officials etc. who must answer for the suffering inflicted on the people of Ukraine by Russia.

      Reply
        • Russian

          Превосходный аргумент! Кириллицу лень установить? Или свыше твоих возможностей так как даже транслитом не можешь без ошибок?

          Reply
  2. Next Stop is France

    >fighting in Ukraine

    You know what I want as a New Year present? You, starting to write “Russians fighting AGAINST Ukraine”. If you write Ukraine without “the”, then you should not use that cowardly “in”. Russians are fighting against Ukraine. Ukraine is not a playground, it’s a nation state, which is being invaded by Russia. Start to write it like it is, better late, than never.

    Reply
    • Aric Toler

      What in the world are you talking about. Did you not read the foreword that I included for this?
      Should I say fighting “at” Ukraine or “on” Ukraine? Around? Within? Throughout? I’m not sure what the preposition has to do with anything. This isn’t в \ на.

      Reply
          • Samirr

            English is too poor a language….

            Russia is too poor a country….

            When the average Ukrainian earns more than the average Russian, you are going to regret working at the trollfarm.

          • stranger

            You are asking how I know you are from Ukraine. Ha. You are always demonstrating so nice and touching, a bit rude and ill bred, but childishly naive canonic authentic Ukrainian character. Good luck.

  3. Samirr

    Amnesty won’t be offered…

    With biometrics coming everywhere, these terrorists will never be able to leave Russia without being arrested.

    Russia is going to have to pay reparations.

    Reply
    • oh my goodnes

      well I think Europe is goint to pay what do you think when we opening the border to central asia and Millions of Muslims will come to EU. You know I know what happens in Cologne in Germany the bloody Germans didn´t do nothing. I know that western People are always scarred my Muslims and can´t fight. This is the differece between us and you. And by the way the migrants will come I have a good plan I has just to talk to Sergej Kurgijan or Alexander Dugin.

      Reply
  4. Robert McMaster

    I cannot assess your piece in detail but it gives good appearance of serious work. So long as you are in good faith then this deserves respect and congratulations. I am a supporter of Russia and the rebels. I disapprove of the Kiev regime but decent reporting I admire. It’s just – so what? There’s 3 million Ukrainians who fled to Russia where they get a decent welcome unlike anywhere else in the west. You think they’re short of volunteers? If this is all the formal Russian military has sunk into east Ukraine be thankful they don’t regard it to invest like Syria.

    This issue is finished. The Ukraine is toast. It was betrayed by Brussels and Washington and is now going to have to undergo painful civil and economic chaos. Better to come to honourable terms with the east and Russia. At least Putin will hold up his end of an agreement.

    Reply
  5. Mad Dog

    Just waiting for the Leningrad Trolls to come out and say how all of this was faked by the Ukrainian services. However, it would seem to be more than damning evidence that Putin is again caught lying about Russian forces participating in some conflict. Great detective work. These guys deserve a rest and their leaders deserve to be hung for putting these troops into harms way for a lost cause. Truth shall prevail thanks to diligent citizens like Askai!

    Reply
  6. stranger

    That was 2.5 years ago. Now the most important is to implement the Minsk agreements. Many people would prefer to forget about Minsk. You are focusing on the actions of years ago as if no any Minsk ever exists.

    Reply
    • Russian

      I think most people on this site will be willing to move on to (or even into) Minsk (or pinsk or minks or even babruysk) if you (and other Russian cheerleaders) finally come clean and admit the fact that Russian regular military forces with concealed military insignia were fighting in the Donbass, as was aptly documented and demonstrated here and countless other sources time and time again, thus constituting an invasion of Ukraine by Russia.
      Same goes for MH17.
      Because once you admit to the above, the Minsk points become moot since it does not clearly identify Russia’s responsibility in the initiation, stoking of and participation in active military and informational war against Ukraine and is akin to trying to eradicate a Malaria epidemic without naming the transmitter or draining the neighboring swamps.

      Reply
      • stranger

        Minsk is not intended to identify anyone’s responsibility. Minsk is a practical way to reach peace respecting the voice and the rights of the eastern Ukrainians. That’s why it is more important, than shaking the air with blaming Russia by the events of years ago.

        Russian – are you really Russian? Why are you so neglecting your motherland? Usually that is not intrinsic to the Russian character. From your previous comments one might guess you are living in Israel. If that is so by any chance, you know how Israilians, with huge number of Russian immigrants among them, care about their own state? You know on the other hand their war crimes in Palestina and treating their Arabic citizens as a second grade people? If so, why so double standard to Russia?

        Reply
  7. Mad Dog

    No stranger. I think we are focusing on the lies of the Putin regime in this whole mess. It is made out by the Russian media that this was some kind o spontaneous, indigenous uprising, brave Russian speakers valiantly defending against the fascists, but this kind of stuff show that this is just another power play like in the Crimea, with secret armies doing the combat. Also, this kind of thing makes the MH17 case even more suspicious, leading one to believe that it was Russian troops in control. Not so far fetched really.

    Reply
    • stranger

      I mean, you always focus on the topics to blame Russia. Bi-cats have never ever touched dangerous topics such as the snipers at Maydan, the support of neo-na3i groups and they role in the revolution, the war crimes of Ukraine and the failure of Ukraine to implement Minsk. Such topics work for the escalation of the conflict not for finding a solution. Minsk is supposed to settle the peace. That’s why Ukraine and supporting them mass media prefer to forget about it.

      As for the uprising, they might have not uprisen w/o Strelkov, but most of the locals did support him. Now after 3 years of fighting, they are not going to give up and return under Ukraine at any conditions. W/o Russian help they would have been smashed by Ukrainian army. There is no military solution to that. Why not to try to negotiate a mutual compromising solution between them, Ukraine, Russia and EU? As for Crimea, the vast majority of Crimeans do support Russia and don’t want to return. Leave them along.

      That started from the attempts of US to split and incite on each other the post Soviet countries due to own geopolitical interests. They have managed that in the case of Georgia and now Ukraine, they have failed but are hard trying with Belorussia and perhaps Armenia. That reminds remotely what was done to the Middle East, where Iran is suppressed, small monarchies of the gulf are favored instead. That configuration allows them to make their enemies to fight between each other by supporting the managed chaos. Divide and Rule is ethereal. Ask where did the snipers at Maydan come from? Ask your government didn’t they think about the consequences when encouraged the conflicts around Russia?

      Reply
      • oui oui

        you have exposed in an old comment that you are a usefull idiot , this doesn’t show that you are usefull but it shows that you are an idiot

        Reply
        • Robert McMaster

          Hey, thats really great that you found the 5 guys who are the foundation of Russian power. Who’d have known they were so…powerful. And then you got that guy oui oui ing all over with clear and understandable answers.

          Reply
          • Mr.Bushkin

            They aren’t even the three guys, who have claimed on social networks to have been awarded with medals in November 2015 according to the article.

  8. Mad Dog

    The snipers from Maydan were from the old regime. No proof of any from the protestors side. What does that have to do with the 61st being in Donbass despite protestations the armed forces of Rodina are not presently or ever in the area. Oh, I see, let’s divert the conversation cause you can’t win this fight on this subject.

    Reply
    • stranger

      The snipers were from the opposition. There are a lot of evidences, and would be a perfect topic for Bi-cats, should they be any objective. The combat weapon appeared at Maydan first, probably from the robed arsenals at the western Ukraine. Then Berkut was given weapon to defend themselves. Why were there so many policemen with fire wounds? There were not from ‘old regime’, just regular and endorsed police defending the law, protecting the administration buildings, got injuried and killed by the crowd for no reason. In any European city police would defend the order. Tell me what happens if you start throwing burning Molotovs and fire on police in you own US? You would be killed immediatelly at place w/o any court or trial.

      I’m saying Bi-cats pay attention to only topics which blame Russia and intentionally avoid any critics of the other side, and giving the examples of snipers, ATO and Minsk which are a taboo for them. You guys, are always pretending you don’t understand when the discussion is going not in your direction, you blame the opponent personally and looking for troll technologies where there are no any hidden meaning. Childish…

      Reply
      • Mad Dog

        Let’s divert more from this topic, okay stranger. Let’s not talk about the facts brought up here. Why? Cause you have no reply to this massive amount of incriminating data. Your ideas about what happened at Maydan have no place here and are pretty well discredited anyway. But that is another topic discussed in other sites and not really a topic BC needs to take up at this point in time. Russian lies about having no military in the fray are pertinent topics though, just like their lies surrounding Syria.

        Reply
        • stranger

          I’m not distracting, please don’t look for a hidden meaning where there is none. I’m disturbed by the single sided interpretation of the Ukrainian events and the level of dirt and lie in the western media. Maydan is important to understand all current events and no-way is irrelevant. Btw, your government played a crucial role at Maydan. What I wrote about Maydan to the best of my understanding, has never been disproved here. I know it is a sacred topic for some people and don’t mean to hurt their feelings. Many people were just deceived though.

          What am I supposed to say about the article? That they have managed to find only 5 guys for the 3 years of war and are saying it is all Russian army? The guys should be volunteers, that has been known for a long time. Provided the research was not faked, because it is originating from Ukrainian ‘informational resistance’ resources, similar to ‘civil activists’ from Syria. The report looks consistent from the first glance though.

          Reply
          • Mad Dog

            Wow, you really love conspiracy theories. 5 guys means nothing, but 5 guys and their equipment plus a whole bunch of others who are unidentified as yet lounging around in ex-Ukrainian barracks means a lot. Really really do not see this as being volunteers no matter how many times you and RT repeat that lie. So, despite your reservations about the source (really, I thought this stuff came straight off Russian versions of FB!) that does not disprove anything. Also, you have never ever been able to prove that all of this was a result of US meddling. Even your statement about HRC and re-sovietization means nothing at all except a realization that people in the US were (justly) worried about Putin blackmailing countries back into the fold. Sorry, don’t see any dirt and lies in the reputable US press. Just relating the truth which is very hard to come by in Russia, as you so readily pointed out with your citation of ‘free’ media outlets viewed by Russians (Riga is still in an independent country as far as I know).

          • stranger

            Meduza was founded by Timchenko who was the chief editor in Russian online lenta.ru. When she was fired for the disagreement with the management, she organized her own online news media Meduza. I didn’t know that is also a news paper in Riga. I thought about Meduza as a Russian resource, Timchenko is from Russia. But if so, let’s omit Meduza, there are many other opposition resources in Russia.

          • stranger

            You better ask who is funding Meduza, because the site is highly unprofitable according to wiki, while Timchenko is far not a billionaire.

    • Mr.Bushkin

      Quote: “The snipers from Maydan were from the old regime.”

      There certainly were snipers from law enforcement, but also plenty of other snipers: bbc.com/news/magazine-31359021

      Reply
      • Mad Dog

        Wow, you really love conspiracy theories. 5 guys means nothing, but 5 guys and their equipment plus a whole bunch of others who are unidentified as yet lounging around in ex-Ukrainian barracks means a lot. Really really do not see this as being volunteers no matter how many times you and RT repeat that lie. So, despite your reservations about the source (really, I thought this stuff came straight off Russian versions of FB!) that does not disprove anything. Also, you have never ever been able to prove that all of this was a result of US meddling. Even your statement about HRC and re-sovietization means nothing at all except a realization that people in the US were (justly) worried about Putin blackmailing countries back into the fold. Sorry, don’t see any dirt and lies in the reputable US press. Just relating the truth which is very hard to come by in Russia, as you so readily pointed out with your citation of ‘free’ media outlets viewed by Russians (Riga is still in an independent country as far as I know). As for the plenty of other snipers, that article really only proves that maybe there were two guys from the opposition firing and maybe there were some there in response to the brutality of the 18th, before 50 protestors were shot! Sooo, how many police were shot? According to that article there were 5. Big difference. Still, what was the 61st doing in Donbass?????

        Reply
        • stranger

          You also love conspiracy as we have seen. Being the Secretary of State, Clinton claimed they are working to “delay or prevent” the intergradation of Ukraine with Russia. She either lied or they actually worked to split our countries. Despite of her awful reputation I believe that time she was not lying as usual. Obama claimed to ‘we have brokered the transition of power in Ukraine’, meaning to bring own people into the power and get rid of all their opponents with ‘lustration’. America is known to finance and organize the coups all over the world, since at least 60s and always pursue only their own interests, not just ‘worried that Putin blackmailed the neighbors”. Maybe this time they didn’t plan the overthrow from the beginning, but definitely prepared to situation, and fully used their chance to help the uprising and manage the way it was going.
          What did Putin blackmailed with? Told that if Ukraine nullifies the customs protection tariffs with Europe, the stream of cheap European products would flow into Russia and damage Russian manufacturers? He honestly and directly said, you can, but if you do that, Russia will introduce own tariffs with Ukraine, he proposed the loan that Ukraine desperately needed w/o harsh conditions of IMF. European deal was discriminating to Ukraine and harmful to Russia, and Russia just provided the better deal.
          This article is based on the materials collected by the Ukrainian blogger Ascai707. Strictly speaking the links provided are not from the social media directly, but from their snapshots from archive.is, a small site belonging to someone Denis Petrov. Just absolutely hypothetically the employees of the site might have been asked to fake something in archive, as well as the employees of vk.com, but vk.com is much more bigger and organized. I’m not saying they were, just the credibility to the sources is rather limited.
          But anyway they have found a couple of guys, who had served in the military in Russia before, but that is not the Russian army and the ‘occupation’. Russian army looks like in Syria, like in Georgia in 2008, like in Crimea after all. Nothing like that you can find at Donbass. The limited support to keep the eastern Ukrainian rebels from being smashed by Ukrainian regular army maybe. Do you think those guys were ordered to go to Ukraine against their will? So they are volunteers, the other question is that Russia encouraged them, supplied and didn’t pursue.
          You may not see the lie in the western media, but Americans did and voted against the strong propaganda for Clinton. Trump is anyway more honest and not involved into the corruption so far. Nobody knowns yet what it will be like, but Clinton was really an awful candidate. They thought that if America had elected a black president, this time they would vote for the first female president. And that would be great if she was deserving that, but her only merit was to be the wife of the former president Clinton and the personification of the current establishment pursuing the globalization, the world domination and the removal of the improper regimes on their way.
          At Maydan snipers killed 20 law enforcement officers and injured at least 150 by bullets, 1120 more policemen were injured not by bullets. There are also the witnesses that the same bullet type was used to kill protesters. Not proved, but he investigation of snipers has not finished even today in Ukraine. The reason to fire was obviously to enrage people and escalate the confrontation which fully succeeded. About 106 protesters died, much more injured, they called them the ‘heavens hundred’.

          Reply
        • Mr.Bushkin

          Quote: “Wow, you really love conspiracy theories.”

          Really?

          Quote: “Really really do not see this as being volunteers no matter how many times you and RT repeat that lie.”

          Which RT? BBC is BBC.

          Quote: “So, despite your reservations about the source (really, I thought this stuff came straight off Russian versions of FB!) that does not disprove anything.”

          Where is the connection to my posting?

          Quote: “Also, you have never ever been able to prove that all of this was a result of US meddling.”

          Why should I bother to prove your statements? Where is the connection to my posting?

          Quote: “Even your statement about HRC and re-sovietization means nothing at all except a realization that people in the US were (justly) worried about Putin blackmailing countries back into the fold. Sorry, don’t see any dirt and lies in the reputable US press.”

          What re-sovetization? I have linked an BBC article your highly praised western press.

          Quote: “As for the plenty of other snipers, that article really only proves that maybe there were two guys from the opposition firing and maybe there were some there in response to the brutality of the 18th, before 50 protestors were shot!”

          They have been filmed and interviewed. There are documentaries and even pop songs about them: youtube.com/watch?v=D-HHnsOKu2k#t=1m44s

          Reply
        • Mr.Bushkin

          Quote MadDog: “Wow, you really love conspiracy theories.”

          It is you, who hangs out here, but by the way: The Buk M1 TELAR “3×2” filmed in Russia has a clearly visible step right to the engine exhaust over the last wheel: 017qndpynh-flywheel.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/buk_compare.jpg

          The Buk M1 TELAR filmed in Eastern Ukraine however seems to be in opposition to TELAR “3×2” an earlier variant without such feature, which has been added to vehicles produced later without being fitted to vehicles produced previously: youtube.com/watch?v=Sf6gJ8NDhYA&t=202s

          Reply
  9. Samirr

    Hey Russian trolls, Ukraine is no longer your bitch.

    Putin is scared of Ukraine

    If Ukraine stamps out corruption, what can Putin do? Not pay your troll farm.

    Is Russia really a federation?

    Russia is going to crumble because their own mismanagement.

    Reply

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